Gentoo kernels

So I'm in the (neverending) process of installing Gentoo on my Sun Blade 100. According to TFM, once this emerge system gets done the next step is to configure a kernel and build it. It says that i should either get the vanilla sources or sparc sources from Gentoo. I'm thinking that there's absolutely no reason that I can't just get the kernel.org sources and configure them and build them like I normally do (and that that should be pretty equivalent to using the Gentoo vanilla sources). Is that correct?

Out of curiosity, has anyone else run Gentoo on Sparcs? I'm interested to see how it runs on this machine.

If I am not mistaken that is what the vanilla sources are. It also helps, to keep things easy to update and you are guaranteed at least a small level of confidence that they will work with gentoo, to use packages that are in portage. This will be even more important once the emerge security option is finalized and implemented. However, if you want to do things manually, and somethings you just have to or submit an ebuild, then you will have to keep up on security updates on your own.

If I am not mistaken that is what the vanilla sources are.

That's my impression, but I wanted to ask someone more experienced with Gentoo. That would be you, btw. ;-D

It also helps, to keep things easy to update and you are guaranteed at least a small level of confidence that they will work with gentoo, to use packages that are in portage. This will be even more important once the emerge security option is finalized and implemented. However, if you want to do things manually, and somethings you just have to or submit an ebuild, then you will have to keep up on security updates on your own.

Are you referring to the kernel specifically here, or packages in general? Unless there's a compelling reason (like horrible performance due to binary compatibility issues in crypto packages on debian-sparc), the only things that I always compile from upstream are BIND and the kernel.

Thanks much for the reply Jeff, all advice is greatly appreciated. The gentoo-sparc developers have been really nice and helpful, but I would of course prefer to ask questions of people I know personally ;-).

Packages in general including the kernel. I try not to use things that are not in portage, especially on my web box, just so that vulnerabilities don't bite me in the a--. I even have my boxes automatically rsync for me so that I can stay updated as much as possible. Beware however if you have multiple gentoo boxes comming from the same IP (NAT). If you rsync more than once a day commonly they will black-list you for a while. I painfully know this from past experience. Having 5 gentoo boxes behind a NAT box can be problematic for these sorts of things. :)

Not a problem at all, I really love gentoo and any help I can provide to help people see the light of gentoo is a great reward for me :)

FYI -- I tend to use the gentoo-sources or the gss-sources (file server on IBM server hardware) just because they include some nice patches to the kernel for functionality. This can be painful at times because of some of the stability of patches, but for the most part they are pretty darn stable.

If you rsync more than once a day commonly they will black-list you for a while. I painfully know this from past experience. Having 5 gentoo boxes behind a NAT box can be problematic for these sorts of things. :)

Is there a Gentoo equivalent of apt-proxy? In case you're not familiar with it, you can use it with Debian (and probably anywhere else that you can use apt) to cache packages for your local network so that they're only fetched once from the mirrors, avoiding such problems. Of course, I could always write a script to rotate through my IPs, but that's just ghetto.

Speaking of IPs, I have a funny Cox story. :P I called tech services to get my other 3 new static IPs. The guy I talked to said "I just want to make you aware of the way our IP provisioning software works. When I tell it to give you 3 new IPs, unless the 3 IPs sequential to the ones you have now are available, it's going to assign you a new, different block of 5 sequential IPs. Is that OK?". I said, "Well, obviously that's not desirable, but if that's the way it works, that's the way it works." So he puts in the request, and says "Yup, that's what it did. So you have 5 different IPs now. They're x.x.x.48, .49, .50, .51, and .5." I say, "Your IP provisioning software thinks that .48-.51 and .5 are sequential?!" He says, "Yeah, isn't that weird?"

So the most obvious reason for that (at least to me) is that the numbers are being sorted "alphabetically" rather than numerically, such that it thinks that the sequence is .48, .49, .5, .50, and .51. That isn't a problem for me, and in fact I'd actually prefer that they not all be truly sequential. But my subnet is 255.255.255.192, so if that's the case, it's going to come back and bite them in the ass sooner rather than later. Whoever ends up with .7 and .70, .8 and .80, or .9 and .90 is screwed. :shock:

- Colleen

app-admin/gentoo-rsync-mirror is what you are looking for and you better have quite a bit of free space as well, at least if you want to house the distfiles portion of it as well as just the portage tree. Default config excludes this so you should be okay. Docs say you need around 250MB to mirror.

If you want my config that I used to set this up let me know. I got to looking around and decided that I needed to do this. It didn't take long to setup and the gentoo site has a great little guide for doing it.

If you want my config that I used to set this up let me know. I got to looking around and decided that I needed to do this. It didn't take long to setup and the gentoo site has a great little guide for doing it.

Sure! That would be much appreciated.

BTW, since you recommended emerging kernel sources rather than working from kernel.org tar.bz2, I decided to emerge sparc-sources and customize that. After a failed compile (CONFIG_STACK_DEBUG is evil) I have a kernel that is just barely under the 3.5MB limit post-stripping, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it will boot when I get to that point. ;-)

- Colleen

Yeah, I know the feeling that is kind of like playing russian-roulet. Course the live cd can be used to boot up the system, it is just a pain in the butt to mount everything and get back into the chroot. But atleast all is not lost :)

Course the live cd can be used to boot up the system, it is just a pain in the butt to mount everything and get back into the chroot. But atleast all is not lost :)

Which is a good thing, because that is exactly what I am going to have to do. The kernel I built gets a particularly ugly kernel oops on boot, complete with ascii art of something sticking its tongue out at me :P

I suspect it has something to do with the fact that I included PAX and grsecurity. PAX especially has been known to cause problems on sparc, so I knew I was tempting fate but thought it was worth a shot. I'll have to try a more conservative kernel config now and see what happens.

This machine has been a bigger PITA than any of my other Suns - I haven't managed to successfully install Debian on it either. The problems there range from the ISO's having beef with my keyboard, and the netboot image not including drivers for my NIC. The machine definitely prefers Solaris to Linux, but I don't. :)

Well, good luck with grsecurity, I really screwed up my first install when trying to enable grsecurity. I haven't gone back since then, but I probably should take a look again. Good Luck.

PS. Oh, by the way I use the live cd to resize my lvm partitions too, it is such a great disc. I always make sure I have one around for things such as that. :)

Recompiling kernel now from my config less grsecurity. Please all cross fingers that that was the problem. :D

The machine definitely prefers Solaris to Linux, but I don't. :)

really? on Sparc hardware? I'll be the first to say that Solaris on i386 sucks mud, but Solaris on Sparc has a lot of things going for it. depending on what you're doing with it, it might not be hard at all to argue for Solaris over linux. not that there aren't plenty of reasons to go with linux as well, but...

what are you using this machine for?

really? on Sparc hardware?
On *my* sparc hardware. This Blade 100 is the fastest one I have, and it's a 500MHz UltraSPARC-IIe. My next newest/fastest is an Ultra 10. The Ultra 10 dual boots Solaris 9 and Debian-sparc, and I use it as a desktop system too.

Other than that, I have a Javastation, a SS 20, 2 SS 10s, an Ultra 1, an E250, and a dead Ultra 5. Sure, you *can* run Solaris 9 on most of those, but who would want to, especially since none of them are used as desktop machines and all run headless and X-less? Debian-sparc runs beautifully on them (well, except the Javastation, but that's an entirely different discussion).

I'll be the first to say that Solaris on i386 sucks mud, but Solaris on Sparc has a lot of things going for it. depending on what you're doing with it, it might not be hard at all to argue for Solaris over linux.
Sure, if I had a Fire 15K or something, I wouldn't be trying to run Linux on it. But like I said, this is the most advanced of my sparc collection and it's an older, single processor desktop PCI/USB/IDE machine.

not that there aren't plenty of reasons to go with linux as well, but...
The most compelling of which (to me) is that I'd rate myself a pretty good Linux admin, but a so-so Solaris admin. :)

what are you using this machine for?
Well, it's a desktop machine, so I use it for desktop and experimentation purposes. Right now, the experiment is seeing how Gentoo runs on ultrasparc, and how it compares to Debian on the same hardware (if I can ever get to that point :D ). It has 2 hd's, and the goal is to triple-boot Solaris 9 (which is already running on the first drive) with Gentoo and Debian (which I'm attempting to get running on the second drive). It runs Solaris decently, but let's be honest here: CDE is one of the ugliest desktop environments ever, and to get the Solaris desktop to look halfway decent you have to run Gnome. Which, of course, I can do under Linux. I just really don't see a lot of advantages to running Solaris on an older desktop machine, even on sparc hardware, other than just to play with and get more Solaris experience, which is why I do it.

you have a Javastation? how cute! any chance you wanna sell it?


now, who said anything about Solaris *9*? the furthest I can go on my personally owned Sparc hardware is 2.6, which is still enough to get me more Solaris experience. like you, I'd rate myself a far better linux admin than Solaris admin (don't tell anyone I work with that I said that). at any rate, it sounds like you've got PLENTY of other Sparc boxes around with which to get your Solaris groove on.

you have a Javastation? how cute! any chance you wanna sell it?
The Javastation I have now is the "Mr. Coffee" model. I guess it's kind of cute, in the "fits in a 611 drive enclosure" sort of way. My sister thinks it's cute, mainly because of the little coffee cup stamped into the enclosure. The "Krups" models are way cuter, I think - they won a few big design awards. I'm not interested in selling mine, but it cost me all of $4.99 on ebay, so you should be able to get one pretty easily.

I've actually been trying to get ahold of one of the "Krups" javastations to play with. I'm gonna bid on this one in a few days (please to not bid against "debiangrrl" :D):
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=11224&item=5723243573&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

oh, yeah, I was thinking of the "Krups" model. the Mr. Coffee is somewhat... less... aesthetically pleasing.

oh, yeah, I was thinking of the "Krups" model. the Mr. Coffee is somewhat... less... aesthetically pleasing.
Yeah, they're just kind of less everything than the newer ones - which is why I must have both! :D